‘I wanted to be sure before denouncing Nazis’, says Moira Deeming

Independent MP Moira Deeming has given evidence that it was ‘difficult’ for her to conceive there were ‘actual, real Nazis’ in 2023 at the Let Women Speak rally.

Moira Deeming on Thursday. Picture: NewsWire / David Crosling

Independent MP Moira Deeming has given evidence that it was “difficult” for her to conceive there were “actual, real Nazis” in 2023 at the Let Women Speak rally and that she was cautious about throwing accusations around, despite a member of the Victorian Liberal Party leadership asking her to denounce the group that performed a Nazi-salute at state parliament.

The Federal Court was shown footage on day four of the high-profile defamation battle between Ms Deeming and Victorian Opposition Leader John Pesutto of the MP appearing alongside British activist Kellie Jay-Keen, former Liberal candidate Katherine Deves and Melbourne woman Angela Jones.

The YouTube video, filmed in the hours after the March 18 event that was gatecrashed by neo-Nazis, depicted the expelled MP sipping champagne with the women and the group discussing the rally.

Ms Keen suggested that the neo-Nazis could have been police or pro-trans rights activists dressed as Nazis.

The court heard that deputy Liberal leader David Southwick had called Ms Deeming that afternoon and asked her to denounce the neo-Nazis immediately.

“It was very difficult for me to conceive of the fact there were actual, real Nazis in Melbourne in 2023,” Ms Deeming said on Thursday. “I thought, surely these are just a bunch of horrendous, offensive, idiot young people. I just needed to be very, very careful before I made that accusation. It’s such a bad accusation, this is the most serious thing you can say.”

Ms Deeming addressed the request of Mr Southwick and said “It doesn’t matter who on earth tells me anything”.

“I’m not calling someone an actual Nazi unless I’m sure and I condemned their Nazi salute,” she said. “And I just needed to be sure before I actually said that they were self-confessed Nazis.”

Earlier, lawyers for Mr Pesutto claimed Ms Deeming had “mischaracterised” her account of the March 19 meeting with the Victorian Liberal Party leadership

The exiled MP remained under oath for a second full day as Matthew Collins KC, acting for the state Opposition Leader, compared her written evidence of the meeting to the secret audio tape of it.

Mr Collins put to Ms Deeming that she gave evidence that Mr Pesutto told her that if she wanted to advocate for “fringe issues” like sex-based rights, the leadership team believed the MP would be better suited as sitting as an independent.

“Do you accept Mr Pesutto, in fact, no one in the leadership team at any time in that meeting used the word ‘fringe’ to describe your views in respect of sex-based rights?” he said.

“I accept that my recollections in my affidavits conflict with the recording,” Ms Deeming responded.

Victorian Liberal Party leader John Pesutto arrives at the Federal Court of Victoria with his wife Betty on Thursday. Picture: NewsWire / David Crosling

The barrister shot back: “Well, it’s more than that Ms Deeming, your recollection is wrong in almost every respect.”

Sue Chrysanthou, appearing for Ms Deeming, said Mr Pesutto’s lawyer was wrong to say her client’s account of the meeting is “wholly incorrect”.

Judge David O’Callaghan was then told that Ms Deeming had provided wrong accounts in her written evidence. “She’s characterised this entire meeting as if the attack upon her was about her advocacy for sex-based rights. It’s wrong. It’s objectively wrong. It’s a total mischaracterisation of what happened in the meeting,” Mr Collins said.

It comes as affidavits, including documents from former Liberal candidate Warren Mundine and the MP’s husband, Andrew Deeming, were released by the court.

The Indigenous leader said Ms Deeming had confided in him and that she was “devastated” by publications made by Mr Pesutto.

“I recall that Moira told me that her young children were saying “My mum’s a Nazi’ … She was distraught that her children were saying this.”

Andrew Deeming gave evidence that he was worried the publications had damaged his wife and that “she will not recover … She is withdrawn and afraid to go out in public, which has meant we cannot go out much as a family.”

The trial continues.