Q+A: ‘We are being confronted by a great power’
Lockdowns, vaccines and China were the main subjects of concern on this week’s edition of the ABC’s panel program.
Lockdowns, vaccines and China were the main subjects of concern on this week’s Q+A, with Thursday’s panel debating Australia’s response to the pandemic and Scott Morrison’s upcoming G7 summit in England.
The panel included Australian Medical Association president Omar Khorshid, epidemiologist Kamalini Lokuge, journalist Peter Hartcher, Indigenous leader Sally Scales and economist Cameron Murray.
Debate began with the proposition of mandatory Covid-19 vaccinations, with Dr Khorshid suggesting “there are some circumstances where we (AMA) believe compulsory vaccines should be considered,” referring to aged care workers as a prime example.
While agreeing with Dr Khorshid, Dr Lokuge said it was crucial that the public did not feel it was being lectured and coerced into action.
“What we know is you only succeed in controlling these types of diseases if the community is a respected partner and with you not lecturing them and not forcing them to do things.”
Australia’s response to Covid-19 and the opening of international borders formed the most contentious subject of the evening, with Dr Murray criticising the government’s approach to the pandemic, saying the country has failed to develop an “endgame” strategy for dealing with the virus.
“Let’s be serious,” said Dr Murray, “we‘re sitting here saying we should vaccinate 100 per cent of people before we open borders?”
“We know some are talking about making this (approach) compulsory when we know children have extremely low risks … We know schools were open for 18 months in Sweden and no children died.”
Dr Murray said the approach “seems like a complete imbalance and a rejection of public health messaging of maximising total health and total wellbeing.”
But Dr Lokuge rebuffed Dr Murray, saying: “What we are aiming for is a level of vaccine coverage that means we are not going to get to high levels of transmission and be constantly”.
“If you look at what‘s happening in the UK at the moment, they have almost 50 per cent coverage and they started to open up. They opened up to other countries in Europe. They’ve now had to close to Portugal.
“Their Prime Minister has said ‘we may need to delay opening up because we've got a new variant and got increasing hospitalisations and an increased number of cases’.”
“I think waiting a few months to get to a level of vaccine coverage where we know we can control this disease without stringent measures is a no-brainer.”
However, Dr Murray said the development of vaccines “was a stroke of luck”, asking Dr Lokuge: “What was your plan if there was no vaccine for another two years?”
Dr Lokgue labelled Dr Murray’s position as “1918 thinking”.
“That did inform some of our prior pandemic planning … The fact is the influenza pandemic that everyone keeps referring to happened more than 100 years ago. It happened directly after one of the most traumatic events in history, World War I, and in a time when biomedical research and health systems were rudimentary at best.”
“We’re in a different situation,” said Dr Lokgue, adding “I had every expectation we would have vaccines”.
Concerning the vaccination of children, Dr Murray said it was misplaced to emphasise their inoculation in the rollout.
“I have no idea why we‘re vaccinating kids. It is very mild (Covid-19) in kids … Give me some information that says otherwise because I’ve been reading everything I can and it makes no sense.”
Dr Khorshid agreed with Dr Murray, saying children “don‘t catch Covid-19 as much … That is one of the realities and it is true”.
But warned him that “we are now starting to see children getting sick and ending up in hospital with Covid, and children have died from this virus around the world”.
“I can tell you now the scientists, the experts that make these decisions, will not recommend these vaccines for children until there‘s a direct benefit, not just for the community, but for the children themselves.”
“They‘re not going to vaccinate kids to protect us or older Australians,” said Dr Khorshid. “They’re getting kids vaccinated because it’s good for the children themselves.”
On the subject of China, the panel fielded questions on Australia’s relationship with China, as well as Scott Morrison’s upcoming G7 summit.
Opening comments, Mr Hartcher said it was an obvious misnomer to consider Australia’s grievances with China to be over trade.
“We are being confronted by a great power, determined to break Australia’s sovereign will. That’s what this is about,” Mr Hartcher said.
“The Chinese government has put trade sanctions on a bunch of Australian products … But the problem isn't with trade.
“How can we be so sure? Because when the Chinese handed one of my colleagues a written list of 14 demands on Australia … How many were about trade? None.”
Responding to questions on Scott Morrison’s visit to Cornwall, Ms Scales said: “Australia is doing horribly on so many things: climate change, our human rights, we’re failing when it comes to our children, the detention centres … all this is failing and I‘m sure that’s going to be coming up”.
Ms Scales concluded by saying: “Scott Morrison is a savvy politician who will change the conversation when he needs to … So I‘m sure there will be times when the China rhetoric will bounce back up.”
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