Waleed Aly slammed again after Heritier Lumumba interview resurfaces

Waleed Aly is under pressure to apologise for his role in a damning interview after fellow Channel 10 star Peter Helliar fell on his sword.

There have been calls for Waleed Aly to follow Peter Helliar’s lead and apologise for an interview with former AFL player Heritier Lumumba in 2017 after a bombshell report during the week found Collingwood guilty of fostering “systemic racism”.

The report was instigated after Lumumba made damning claims about enduring a “culture of racist jokes” and being nicknamed “Chimp” while playing for the Pies between 2005-2014.

Lumumba won a premiership with Collingwood in 2010 but said he was “ostracised internally” when he tried to speak out against alleged racism at the club.

Aly interviewed Lumumba in 2017 for an episode of Channel 10 show The Project, during which the defender’s alleged nickname was discussed.

Aly’s fellow panellist Helliar questioned the authenticity of Lumumba’s allegations in that interview, saying at the time “it would be really helpful if we heard more detail, especially with the nickname” and claiming Lumumba risked “smearing an entire club” if his story could not be verified.

Many have since come out and said Lumumba has been vindicated by this week’s damning report, which accused Collingwood’s responses to instances of alleged racism of being “at best ineffective, or at worst exacerbated the impact of the racist incidents”.

Helliar apologised on Twitter this week for his reaction back in 2017, writing: “I urge all fans & members to demand better from @CollingwoodFC. This report is heartbreaking. To @iamlumumba I am truly, unequivocally sorry. I should have believed you. I will do better.”

There are now questions over whether Aly should follow suit for the scepticism with which he treated some of the footy star’s allegations during their interview.

For the record, here’s part of the chat between the pair, where Aly appeared to cast doubt on Lumumba being nicknamed “Chimp”.

Not everyone thought the interview went well.

Aly: One thing I’ve noticed with the “Chimp” stuff specifically, there aren’t many players who say that they heard that, there aren’t many people at the club who say that they heard that, so that’s why I’m trying to get a sense of how widespread it was.

Lumumba: I would say that I would be very surprised if a majority of players weren’t aware of the racist jokes or the nickname.

Aly: But they’re saying they’re not. That’s the thing.

Heritier: Hang on. What they’re doing is consistent with the way they’ve been in the past.

Aly: But even someone like Leon Davis, who says, ‘I experienced racism. Heritier experienced racism. That’s terrible’. This was your nickname around the club for 10 years, he would have heard that, surely, wouldn’t he? Especially if he’s sympathetic to the concerns that you’re raising.

Lumumba: Leon Davis said he experienced the same thing, a similar thing when he arrived at the club as a young player.

Aly: He’s not verifying the nickname, this is my point.

Lumumba: Waleed, let’s have a look at racism. You’re getting caught up on a nickname, which is very easy to do.

Aly: I’m not trying to get caught up on a nickname. What I’m trying to say is your …

Lumumba: Let’s look at racism, let’s look at racism and let’s have a look (at) what I’m saying. This is what I’m saying, is that there was a culture that normalised racist jokes.

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Lumumba wants Collingwood to take ownership of its failings.

Ex-Collingwood players Brent Macaffer, Chris Dawes and Andrew Krakouer have all said they heard the nickname “Chimp”, while Davis also later confirmed it.

Aamer Rahman, who says he was in the room with Lumumba and Aly when the interview took place, has previously slammed The Project’s treatment of the story on social media. He came out swinging against Aly again this week after Helliar’s apology, saying Aly needs to follow suit.

“Heritier Lumumba deserves a complete, on-air apology from Waleed Aly and @theprojecttv that acknowledges the role they played in covering for @CollingwoodFC’s racism, not a lone tweet from Peter Helliar. This is a permanent stain on the program’s history,” Rahman tweeted.

“Waleed Aly asked us to forgive Sonia Kruger when she said Muslims should be banned from Australia, but can’t find the energy to apologise to Heritier Lumumba for treating him like a liar when he said he was a victim of racism.”

Last year, Rahman wrote of Aly’s interrogation of Lumumba: “The questions were bizarre. For example, if Heritier was telling the truth, why wouldn’t more players admit to a culture of racism at the club? Imagine staking a victim’s credibility on why none of their abusers had publicly admitted to their behaviour.

“An hour and a half of this brought Heritier to tears. Still, we hoped that Waleed was just being extra rigorous and the final edit would be good. It wasn’t.”

Lumumba remains hurt by the way his interview went in 2017, saying he was asked to appear on The Project again this week.

“So @theprojecttv sent me a request to be on their program. I considered it for a moment, then remembered what happened in 2017,” Lumumba tweeted, pointing to Rahman’s thread about his issues with how the show treated the Collingwood star four years ago.

Network 10 declined to comment.