Moment Ibrahim associate Ryan Watsford found out his friend was an undercover cop
Ryan Watsford was one of the few outsiders welcomed into the Ibrahims’ tight circle, but he was also the man who introduced an undercover officer to the crew. Police delivered the crushing news to Watsford in a recorded interview. LISTEN TO THE MOMENT HE FINDS OUT.
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For three decades, Sydney has regarded the House of Ibrahim with fear and fascination
Now, for the first time, we take you inside the private world of this complicated family thanks to an enormous cache of surveillance material tendered to a NSW court.
There are more than 880 phone calls and texts that were covertly recorded by police over more than a year, revealing the truth about feuds, grudges and family lore, including the secret tunnel under patriarch John Ibrahim’s Eastern Suburbs mansion.
There are hundreds of police photos taken inside Ibrahim homes during police raids, and an even larger collection of surveillance photos taken by police tailing family members and associates through the city’s streets.
The material sheds new light on the family’s networks, reaching beyond brothers John, Fadi, Michael and Sam to the far reaches of entertainment, night-life, property and crime. On their private calls, the brothers and their associates detail their rivalries and power struggles, as well as moments of “us against the world” camaraderie and black humour.
When police make an arrest, their biggest frustration is the lies the criminal tells in the ensuing interview.
In his police interview, tendered in court, that’s exactly what Ryan Watsford is doing. But the police are about to play a soul-destroying ace.
It is 5.54am on August 8, 2017, Watsford had just been at his mother’s Rose Bay villa in Sydney’s Eastern Suburbs. He hasn’t exercised his right to silence and is answering questions — mostly untruthfully.
The Australian Federal Police officers are asking Watsford about his mate, Joe Smith*, who helped him in a plot to smuggle 800kg of MDMA and millions of bootleg cigarettes into Australia. Watsford has pleaded guilty but it currently negotiating the agreed facts.
LISTEN TO RYAN WATSFORD’S REACTION
READ THE TRANSCRIPT: WARNING GRAPHIC LANGUAGE
Since meeting just over a year ago, Watsford formed a lucrative illegal business relationship with Smith, whose skill set included money laundering and smuggling drugs and tobacco past Australian border authorities.
Just as important to Watsford, he considered Smith as one of his close friends.
The pair partied in Thailand and lunched together at the Royal Motor Yacht Club in Point Piper. Watsford even revealed intimate details about his personal life.
In the biggest show of faith, Watsford brought Smith into the fold with the Ibrahim family. This resulted in Smith importing millions worth of drugs and tobacco for Michael Ibrahim.
In the early stages of his police interview played in court, Watsford was evasive and confident when one of the officers asked how many times he met Smith.
“I met him a couple of times. That’s it … and that’s the truth,” Watsford, who still had no eyebrows and painted on henna replacements when talking to police, said.
After several stoppages, the police had run out of patience and Federal Agent Duncan Hayes played his card.
“I’ll put it to you at this point in time that when I refer to Joe Smith, I’m referring to an undercover police officer,” Agent Hayes said.
Watsford sat silent as the cold revelation washed over him.
He had to ask again.
“And (the) undercover police officer is Joe Smith?” Watsford asked.
Agent Hayes replied: “Correct”.
“All this offending that we have evidence on you (being involved) in a criminal syndicate (is because) we have telephone intercepts, we have surveillance, we have undercover recordings,” Agent Hayes said.
Watsford needed the interview to be suspended to process the information.
“Can I talk to my lawyer for a minute,” he asked the officers.
Later in the interview, Watsford said: “I feel like vomiting all over this table … I thought he was a friend, you know what I mean? I thought he was a mate …”
The police grilled Watsford for hours. It was a textbook demonstration in how to break the confidence of an interview subject.
When the interview resumed, Watsford’s demeanour had changed. His voice reduced to a mumble. He was in shock and had given up his resistance.
Agent Hayes asked Watsford if he paid $50,000 to the undercover as a deposit for one of the tobacco imports.
“It’s true,” Watsford said.
“He gave me a carton of Davidoffs two years ago,” he continued. “White Davidoffs as a (birthday) present and a bottle of scotch.”
“We became mates. Started talking,” Watsford said. “I thought he was a nice guy. He’s obviously not.”
Then Watsford had some questions of his own.
“How long has he been an undercover police officer for?” Watsford asked.
Agent Hayes replied: “I can’t provide you with those details.”
By this stage, Watsford’s propensity to stutter when he is stressed was starting to emerge.
“And why was — why — why did he try and, um, ah, target me?” he asked.
The officers stuck to their strategy.
“I can understand there’s a lot to process. I can’t answer those questions,” Agent Hayes said. “What we’re here to talk about is your involvement in these offences.”
At the start of the interview, Watsford, a former Cranbrook High School student who attempted to make his fortune as a slick Eastern Suburbs wheeler and dealer, tried to use his real estate salesman charm.
At first he tried fake honesty: “I’m not going to sit here and bullshit you mate.”
And then something different when he got caught lying about a drug deal: “I feel like I’m annoying you.”
Humour: “I can’t remember the last broad I had sex with.”
Finally, he played for sympathy: “I’m not well. All right. I’m under a lot of financial stress.”
None of it worked.
As the interview progressed, Watsford learned that the police had been following him for more than a year.
In one exchange when Agent Hayes revealed they had photos of him in a drug deal at Rose Bay. Watsford said: “Are you serious … Can I have a look”.
Watsford looked at the photo and said: “F …, you’re everywhere.”
When the officer asked Watsford if anyone else was present at the meetings with the undercover, Watsford either couldn’t or didn’t want to answer.
“Sorry, I’m just in shock,” Watsford said. “F … I’m just in shock. I’m really sorry.”
The officer then moved to a question about Watsford’s knowledge of a delivery of 100,000 packets of Marlboro Red cigarettes with the undercover.
Watsford had no defences left.
“You already said it,” Watsford replied. “Just how it is. You know how it is. That was an undercover police officer. It is how it is, mate. What do you want me to say.”
Soon after, he said: “I thought he was a complete mate.”
In another exchange, Watsford challenged the police on if they had evidence that he attended a drop off of 100,000 packets of Marlboro Gold cigarettes at a 7-11 in South Strathfield.
“That doesn’t always mean you weren’t present Ryan,” Agent Hayes said. “It just means that we’re not showing you the photo of it.”
Later, Watsford’s feelings of betrayal emerged.
“I never knew what a piece of shit I was dealing with, you know what I mean?” he told the officers. “I had no idea until now, you know. I liked the guy a lot. I thought he was my friend; he was a gentleman and that.”
There were certain topics that Watsford still tried to deny.
Like that he was the user of an encrypted BlackBerry account that was used to communicate with the undercover about smuggling plans.
“I’m not trying to annoy you, I just can’t remember,” Watsford said.
The officers reminded Watsford of his situation.
One of the officers said: “Do you understand that you have been dealing with the undercover for an extensive period of time, and he would take screenshots of the BlackBerry messages?”
“We’ve been listening to your calls,” the officer added.
And there was more.
“Every time that you’ve had a meeting with the UCO (undercover operative) you’ve organised it via BlackBerry,” the officer said. “So every time the UCO has organised to meet the user of that handle, Bushman88 … you have shown up.”
Police said Bushman88 was one of Watsford’s code names.
The officers turned up the heat further, telling Watsford he wasn’t giving them enough.
They wanted names.
“I think it’s time to start … not just waiting for the information to come out,” Agent Hayes said. “We’re finding a lot of contradictions in your story.”
Watsford was rattled: “I can’t mention names.”
Watsford wouldn’t give up the name of Michael Ibrahim to police.
When one of the officers asked “Who’s Mick?”, Watsford replied “It’s not who you think it is … it’s a different Mick.”
“He’s just a normal guy. A driver … A young bloke,” Watsford insisted.
Ending the interview, Watsford said of the undercover: “The guy — I genuinely enjoyed his company. He was a nice person and that … so I take my hat off to him. He did a great job. I mean, what else do you want me to say?
*The undercover’s name has been changed to comply to a court suppression order
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