Julie Bishop digs in against Peter Dutton on surveillance of Australian citizens

Following a series of recent clashes with the Home Affairs Minister, Julie Bishop says she’s unaware of any need to expand cyber spying.

Peter Dutton and Julie Bishop.

Foreign Minister Julie Bishop says she is not aware of any need to expand the powers of Australian cyber spies, exposing stark differences between her and Home Affairs Minister Peter Dutton, who yesterday said there was a “case to be made” for such a move.

The apparent rift follows a series of recent clashes between the pair over issues including the treatment of South African farmers and the establishment of Mr Dutton’s Home Affairs super portfolio.

The Australian Signals Directorate’s current mandate does not focus on monitoring Australian citizens, while the Australian Federal Police and ASIO need warrants to investigate Australians.

However, Department of Home Affairs secretary Mike Pezzullo outlined a plan to Defence Secretary Greg Moriarty in a February letter, published in part by The Sunday Telegraph, to allow ASD personnel to “proactively disrupt and covertly remove” onshore cyber threats — which would potentially involve Australian citizens.

Mr Dutton yesterday said there may be a need for changes due to the ­increasing sophistication of transnational criminal activity such as child exploitation.

Asked whether she agreed with Mr Dutton, Ms Bishop referred to comments she made in response to the Sunday Telegraph article, that there was no proposal before the government to expand the powers of the ASD.

“The three relevant departmental secretaries confirmed that and rejected any suggestion that there is a proposal to use the Australian Signals Directorate, which is within the Department of Defence, to collect intelligence against Australians or access their data,” Ms Bishop told Sky News.

“I take my advice from the security and intelligence agencies and they have not raised with me any issue that would require an expansion of ASD’s powers, such that you would use them against Australians.”

Ms Bishop said ASD fell within the remit of the Department of Defence and Defence Minister Marise Payne.

“But if you’re talking about expanding powers in relation to the surveillance of Australians, that’s a matter for ASIO and the Australian Federal Police and they are completely separate acts, answerable to different ministers, so I don’t’ think we should mix the two issues,” she said.

“ASD is within the military, it’s part of the Department of Defence, answerable to Senator Payne as the Defence Minister, but onshore surveillance in relation to Australians is a matter for ASIO and the Australian Federal Police.”

Asked whether a proposal to extend ASD’s surveillance powers would have to come from Senator Payne and not Mr Dutton, Ms Bishop said the question was “hypothetical”.

“I’m just pointing out the facts as to where these different agencies lie, and if there were any proposal that related to increasing the powers of an agency to act against Australians, it wouldn’t come from ASD and the Minister for Defence I wouldn’t think, because we have an ASIO act and acts that cover the Australian Federal Police,” she said.

“But again we’re talking in hypotheticals. If a minister, if the security and intelligence agencies advise a minister that there is a need to amend our laws, well then of course any proposal would go before the national security committee.

“If it were agreed it would go to the cabinet. If it were agreed it would then go to the parliamentary joint standing committee on security and intelligence matters, it would need to go to our party room. So there is quite a process if there were any gap and there were any proposal at any point. But as I said we’re talking in hypotheticals.

“What I can say without doubt is that the Turnbull government is committed to ensuring that our security and intelligence agencies have the powers they need, have the resources they need to keep Australians safe. That is what we’re committed to ensuring.”

Asked whether she was saying that nothing had come to her attention to suggest there was a need for the ASD’s powers to be expanded, Ms Bishop said:

“I was asked on Sunday whether there was a proposal to expand the powers of the Australian Signals Directorate to enable it to collect data or collect intelligence against Australians, and I said there was no such proposal, and I was backed up by that by the three relevant departmental secretaries, and that I wasn’t aware of any need to expand the powers of ASD in that regard. That remains my position.”