By Rachel Eddie and Annika Smethurst
Deputy Liberal leader David Southwick has told the Federal Court he secretly recorded an internal party meeting as an insurance policy because he could no longer trust Moira Deeming after “the darkest day” of hate on the steps of the Victorian parliament.
Southwick was cross-examined on day 12 of the defamation trial that ousted Liberal Deeming launched against state Opposition Leader John Pesutto.
Deputy Liberal leader David Southwick outside the Federal Court on Wednesday.Credit: Joe Armao
The tape has been a central piece of evidence since it emerged early in the trial. Anger has risen within the party over the secret recording of the meeting between Deeming and senior Liberal figures on March 19, 2023, fanning tensions over the party’s leadership.
Speaking to the media on Wednesday, Pesutto said he still “absolutely” trusted his deputy. He said Southwick had since explained his personal reasons for recording the meeting and keeping it secret, which had allayed some concerns from colleagues.
Deeming helped organise the Let Women Speak rally on the steps of parliament the day before the meeting. Neo-Nazis were among several groups of protesters who arrived that day.
She has denounced Nazism and alleges Pesutto defamed her as a Nazi sympathiser, which he rejects.
Opposition Leader John Pesutto on day 12 of the trial.Credit: Joe Armao
Southwick told the court it was obvious to him at the time that the neo-Nazis were there to support the cause of the Let Women Speak rally given their anti-trans banner, making it especially important that Deeming make clear they were not welcome in her cause.
The court heard Southwick called Deeming on the afternoon of the rally and asked her in specific terms to strongly and urgently call out the neo-Nazis.
Hours later, Deeming wrote on social media that “a bunch of masked men” terrified the women and that the Nazi salute was horrible.
Her barrister, Sue Chrysanthou, SC, put to Southwick that this covered what he had asked for.
Ousted Liberal Moira Deeming.Credit: Joe Armao
Southwick rejected this. “I was shocked in terms of what actually happened,” he told the court.
He said Deeming went on to celebrate the rally and drink champagne with other Let Women Speak organisers, who had questioned in a live YouTube video whether the men in black doing the Nazi salute were actually neo-Nazis or police in costume.
“If somebody performs a Nazi salute, they’re Nazis,” Southwick said. “To behave that way, and to trivialise what was so offensive to me, I felt I couldn’t trust Mrs Deeming. She lied to me.”
Chrysanthou later put to him that he was giving a “pre-prepared” speech. She said Southwick should have taken from the “champagne video” that the women had nothing to do with the Nazis. He disputed this, telling the court she sat through conspiracy theories.
“The actions Mrs Deeming took were more than questionable, and I was very, very upset about it.”
Southwick, who is Jewish, told the court he was shocked about what unfolded, that trivialising it was offensive, and that he found it triggering having to relive the day repeatedly.
He raised a tweet that another organiser, Melbourne woman Angela Jones, posted on the night of the rally that he said used the same language as the neo-Nazis.
“I don’t care what anyone’s cause is, you do not take support from Nazis,” Southwick told the court.
Deeming has rejected in court that the rally was anti-trans or that the neo-Nazis were there to support the cause. She said she was not aware of them until they were escorted out.
The leadership team hauled Deeming into a 70-minute meeting the day after the rally, a meeting the court previously heard that Southwick secretly recorded.
“That was personal to me,” Southwick told the court. “I felt I had to protect myself from what was about to happen, should that happen.”
Southwick said he was prepared to hear Deeming out and decided at the last minute to record the meeting as “an insurance policy”, but hoped it would never have to be used.
He said he had not taped other conversations with colleagues.
Chrysanthou suggested Southwick had kept the recording secret for about nine months because he knew it wouldn’t assist him or Pesutto.
She put to him that the leadership team was holding Deeming to impossible standards to ensure her removal from the Liberal Party room.
Southwick rejected these characterisations.
Pesutto on Wednesday said Liberal frontbenchers Richard Riordan and David Hodgett were “performing well” and would remain in shadow cabinet – despite providing affidavits for Deeming.
“The evidence people give I have always been very respectful of, as an officer of the court,” said Pesutto, who operated his own legal practice prior to entering parliament. “There is no connection between what people do in court and how they perform in their jobs.”
Pesutto said he hadn’t been contacted by colleagues with concerns about his leadership or the party.
“We were all very realistic and sensible about this. It wasn’t my proceeding … and it will be over, basically, by Friday.”
Upper house leader of the opposition Georgie Crozier and Pesutto’s chief of staff, former MP Louise Staley, are expected to be cross-examined on Thursday.
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