I have nothing but respect for Gus, but I wouldn’t be doing my job if I didn’t question him

As a kid, I would rush home from footy training to make sure I could record Phil Gould staring down the camera and delivering his impassioned speech before Origin games, then watch it on repeat until I had memorised all of it.

A big reason I decided to get involved in rugby league media, apart from not being good enough at playing the game, was because of people like Gould and how they inspired me.

So it has always been slightly surreal to find myself sitting with him on Nine’s 100% Footy on Monday nights, and never more so than this week when I found myself in a robust discussion with him about the Lachlan Galvin situation at the Wests Tigers and his forthcoming arrival at the Bulldogs.

I regard it as a privilege to sit alongside Gould on that panel but I never forget why I am there, alongside some of the game’s greats. It’s because I am a journalist.

It’s my job to ask the questions people want answered – plenty of which I didn’t even get to on Monday – regardless of how uncomfortable it may feel.

In the days leading up to the show, I was inundated with messages from people I know and rugby league fans on social media saying they wanted to see Gould questioned over his previous comments that Galvin was not on the club’s radar.

Bulldogs general manager Phil Gould.Credit: Nick Moir

Those comments were made several weeks ago after Galvin and his agent had refused to even allow his incumbent club to table an extension that would have seen him earn $6 million between now and the end of the 2031 season.

“Gus”, as Gould is universally known, does not owe me the truth. I’m not here to pick holes in his comments and timeline, because I understand that his primary commitment is to the Bulldogs.

He is entitled to conduct his business confidentially. But journalists are also entitled to try to find out what is going on. If Gus doesn’t want to talk, that’s fine, journalists can speak to any number of sources to get to the bottom of a story. It’s what we do.

There’s a widely held view that if Gus is going to hold a dual role as general manager of the Bulldogs and the loudest voice at Nine’s Wide World of Sports, the questioning is part and parcel of the deal.

Lachlan Galvin is Belmore-bound.Credit: Steven Siewert

Some in clubland believe he shouldn’t even be in the media because of his role at the Bulldogs. I don’t agree. I think he’s great on TV. I still hang off his every word. He’s the most fascinating rugby league identity there is, however polarising he may be.

Nor do I think that in this instance he has done anything wrong. In his position, I would also say whatever I needed to if it meant Lachlan Galvin ended up at my football club.

I would do whatever was necessary not to undermine my football team, which is flying high at the top of the ladder after a decade of disappointment.

And I certainly wouldn’t admit to anything that might prick the ears of the NRL in regard to a potential breach of the game’s not-so-stringent anti-tampering policy – not that I’m implying that was the case here.

Often the truth isn’t right in front of you. Journalists are forced to navigate their way through the agendas, the half-truths and the self-interest from any number of people to piece together an accurate representation of what is actually going on.

Michael Chammas and Phil Gould went head to head over the Bulldogs and Lachlan Galvin.Credit: Photos: Nine, Getty. Artwork: Aresna Villanueva

“What I do know is there is not another CEO, another general manager or a recruitment manager that has to sit on a panel and answer these questions, week in, week out,” Gould said on Monday night.

But the very fact that Gould does sit on those panels, week in and week out, is a source of frustration for plenty of those other CEOs, GMs and recruitment managers he was talking about.

Gould’s disdain for the media is nothing new, even if it is a bit peculiar given how much time he has spent in front of the cameras, or writing newspaper columns, in a career rivalled by few others.

He has long expressed the belief that the media is at odds with the clubs, causing more problems than benefits for organisations that don’t like their workings being played out in public.

He said as much as I left the set on Monday night, adding that journalists should be aware of the stress and pain they cause players and their families with the speculation. There were no expletives off-air and Gus did not attack me for questioning his integrity.

I get what he is saying about the effect on the players of the media’s round-the-clock coverage of the rugby league soap opera. Clubs, too, can have a negative impact on players and families when they tap them on the shoulder. It comes with the territory.

And, by the same token, it wasn’t me who rejected the Wests Tigers offer.

It wasn’t me who hastily put out a press release informing everyone that my player had no future at the club. I wasn’t the one whose manager told the Tigers that coach Benji Marshall couldn’t develop me as a player.

Wests Tigers coach Benji Marshall.Credit: Getty Images

I didn’t go on social media and take shots at a teammate. I didn’t call the law firm to bring a bullying claim against my club. And I’m not the one who is leaving mid-season with 18 months to run on my contract. To quote Pip Edwards, this is not my circus.

That’s not a crack at Galvin, or his agent Isaac Moses. Moses did exactly what his client wanted – he found an unlikely exit from a club Galvin didn’t want to be at. Any emotional scars are the price of that one-way ticket to Belmore.

In Gould’s defence, he hasn’t been the architect of this forthcoming Galvin deal. That’s been led by Bulldogs assistant coach Luke Vella, who is Galvin’s confidant and former coach at Westfields Sports High School.

Gould wasn’t even at the dinner last Wednesday night when Galvin met with Vella and Ciraldo to discuss his future at the Bulldogs.

Bulldogs assistant coach Luke Vella.Credit: Rhett Wyman

Nor has Gould had the appetite to lead discussions with Galvin’s agent Moses, who was run out of town at Penrith during Gould’s days as Panthers general manager.

I mentioned on 100% Footy last year that I found it interesting that Gould ended his decade-long feud with Moses at the end of last year. His lavish praise of Galvin soon after convinced me the teenager was the end game of his decision to meet with Moses.

Across town at Parramatta, the Eels were under the impression that the Moses one-two punch of Isaac and Mitchell would deliver him to their club. On Friday night, they thought they had a deal done.

They underestimated the influence of Vella and Galvin’s desire to don the blue and white on a deal expected to be worth around $750,000 a season when eventually signed. So the story goes.

Bulldogs general manager Phil Gould.Credit: Nick Moir

“It is gibber. You say a lot of things that just aren’t true. And you say a lot of things that are exaggerated,” Gould said to me on Monday night.

Gould says journalists write stories because “it suits the media’s narratives”. But that’s not right.

Take the Galvin issue for example. Personally, I don’t care whether he goes to Canterbury or Parramatta or if he stays at the Tigers.

I just want to find out what’s happening and relay it to the Herald’s readers and Nine’s viewers. And, of course, I want to do it first. That’s what I’m judged on.

As all journalists learn at some stage in their careers, sometimes sources aren’t as accurate as we would like them to be. Sometimes you are told something as an objective truth but it turns out to be a subjective one. We have to take that into account and so we ask more questions. It’s why we always get at least two sources for our stories. Things change. Goalposts move.

Gould went through it himself last year when this reporter – and presumably others – made enquiries with the Bulldogs about murmurs that winger Josh Addo-Carr had failed a roadside drugs test.

The Bulldogs general manager took to social media, posting on X: “RUMOUR MILL REGARDING JOSH ADDO-CARR in response to circulating rumours and now several media enquiries regarding Josh Addo-Carr … the test results were negative and Josh was allowed to continue on his way.

“Happens to all of us at some stage on the roads. It’s the Police keeping the community safe. We appreciate their work. There is absolutely no truth to rumours that Josh had any issue. None whatsoever. Enjoy your finals football everyone.”

Two hours later the police issued their own statement saying otherwise. A few weeks later, Addo-Carr was moved on. Was Gould lying? Of course not. But the truth can change.

Josh Addo-Carr unsuccessfully pleaded his case to the Bulldogs board at Belmore.Credit: Janie Barrett, SMH

And on Monday night people wanted to see me find out what had happened with the Galvin affair. Had the truth changed again? I tried to find out. I was doing my job and Gus was doing his.

Nothing he said offended me. If I’m going to call into question the intentions of someone on national television, I need to be prepared to wear the black eyes.

There is another point to all this, and it’s about whether the Galvin situation should have been allowed to develop in the first place.

In a way, Galvin – and more importantly the Tigers – have been let down by outdated system around playing contracts. The system should not reward the actions of any party involved in a saga such as the Galvin one that has hijacked the competition over the past six weeks.

Wests Tigers CEO Shane Richardson.Credit: Oscar Colman

No player who breaks or requests to walk out on a contract should get a cent more than their original deal.

Galvin is on about $250,000 this year, which increases to $350,000 next year. If he was not allowed to earn any more than those figures at a rival club in those years, would we have seen the theatrics of the past six weeks? I doubt it.

Instead, he will leave and potentially earn an upgrade on this year’s deal, close to double his salary the following year and the Tigers will be left wondering why they are being punished for doing too good a deal for their club. That’s what the system encourages.

Players who are forced out of their contracts by their own clubs are protected by the NRL, which ensures the athlete isn’t shortchanged if they are squeezed out to a rival team.

The same protection needs to be applied to clubs. That would take away some of the power that is increasingly falling into the hands of the agents.

But this is rugby league. The game outside the game is becoming increasingly prominent. There will always be questions to be asked and there will always be journalists asking them. Some might not like it, but that doesn’t mean we shouldn’t do it.

How it unfolded: A transcript of the discussion on 100% Footy

Chammas: Is it right that you weren’t even at the dinner the other night?

Gould: I haven’t met Lachlan Galvin. I haven’t met Lachlan Galvin. I really haven’t.

Chammas: Why do you not turn up to such a big decision?

Gould: What I do know is there is not another CEO, another general manager or a recruitment manager that has to sit on a panel and answer these questions, week in, week out.

Chammas: But that’s your choice, Gus.

Gould: I’m just saying, you’re getting a free licence here. What I’m saying is that these are things we do internally. Most of our issues internally are created by the gibber in the media, and what you want to do and extend on it.

Chammas: But it’s not gibber. We predicted it was going to end up (with Galvin) at the Bulldogs.

Gould: It is gibber. It is gibber. You say a lot of things that just aren’t true. And you say a lot of things that are exaggerated.

Chammas: We played a highlight clip of what you’ve said over the past few months.

Gould: You’re exaggerating. You’re exaggerating.

Chammas: Tell me which one?

Gould: All of it.

Chammas: Yeah, but we hit you about Lachlan Galvin …

Gould: You exaggerate. You exaggerate what’s going on and that makes it difficult for us. Now I don’t want to sit here and point out everything that you’ve done wrong. It doesn’t worry me and it doesn’t influence me, but it certainly has an effect on the players. And it has an effect on the players and their families. And that’s what you don’t see. And that’s the thing we’ve got to mop up. That’s the thing we’ve got to do.

Chammas: Is that why, then when we ask you about these things, is that why you mislead us with what the information is?

Gould: What have I misled you on?

Chammas: Well, the Galvin situation for one.

Gould: How have I misled you?

Chammas: Leo Thompson, you said that …

Gould: How did I mislead you on Lachlan Galvin?

Chammas: Gus, you were three steps ahead of everyone. To suggest that you didn’t think that Galvin could become …

Gould: You say that. You say that. How did I mislead you on Lachlan Galvin? Go back to everything I said.

Chammas: You said you weren’t interested?

Gould: What?

Chammas: You said you weren’t interested.

Gould: I never, at any time, said we weren’t interested. What I said was …

Chammas: He’s not in your plans.

Gould: … That we’re on a different course. He’s not in our plans because he wasn’t off contract until 2027. We couldn’t talk to him until November.

Chammas: Yeah, but we all knew he was going to leave. We all knew that was going t leave, you could see …

Gould: Well I didn’t know that. I didn’t know that.

Chammas: Oh come on, Gus.

Gould: No, you’re surmising that now because it’s happened. You want that to be the truth.

Chammas: At the time we were all saying ‘how is this going to be tenable?’

Gould: You want that to be the truth. That’s the scenario you want to create.

Chammas: You didn’t see it happening that way?

Gould: No, I didn’t see it happening that way at all. Not at all.

Chammas: I said to you, I joked about it on here that I don’t think it’s a coincidence that you ended your feud with Isaac Moses.

Gould: Why did you assume that I knew that? Why did you assume? Because it suits your narrative.

Chammas: It’s not about narratives.

Gould: It suits the media’s narrative.

Chammas: You ended your feud with Isaac Moses at the end of last year …

Gould: You go back and have a look at everything I’ve said about Lachlan Galvin and what transpired and everything I said was 100 per cent the truth, at the time.

The goalposts moved this week when they came back and said ‘he could be available now’.

Chammas: I don’t doubt that.

Gould: Which I took to the coaches and the coaches went and met with him, not me. The coaches went and met with him.

Chammas: I don’t doubt that.

Gould: I met with the manager Thursday after the coach came back and said ‘this could be an option’. It wasn’t my decision. Coach’s decision.

Chammas: So how does it sit with you then when Andrew Webster writes today (in The Australian) that there are clubs are up in arms, and you spoke about it, you have to come on here and …

Gould: I don’t give a damn about anything Andrew Webster writes, or any journalist in this town, to be honest.

Chammas: But the clubs are obviously starting to say, ‘why can Gus publicly court Lachlan Galvin, tell everyone he’s the best player …’

Gould: How did I publicly court Lachlan Galvin?

Chammas: Well, what you’ve said about him.

Gould: What did I say?

Chammas: You praised him like I’ve never heard before.

Gould: I’ve praised a lot of players. I’ve praised Cameron Smith. Did I ever offer you a contract, Cameron?

Cameron Smith: (Laughing) No

Gould: No, never. Nor would I think you’d ever become available.

Chammas: Do you care though, that other clubs are saying stuff to the NRL?

Gould: I don’t give a rats what other clubs think. You mistake me for someone who cares. What I don’t like is being sit here with a bloke like you, questioning my credibility.

Chammas: I’m not questioning your credibility.

Gould: You are. You said I misled the public. You said I misled you.

Chammas: That’s what everyone’s saying at the moment.

Gould: No, you’re saying it. You’re saying I misled you. I misled no one.

Chammas: When we’re talking about the Galvin situation, there are a number of issues over a number of years …

Gould: I misled no one. I misled no one. Mind your words, son.

Smith: Is there a chance he doesn’t even end up at the Bulldogs? Cause I’m hearing that his first preference is Parramatta?

Chammas: I think, for a while, everyone thought he was going to parramatta. And the talk was, potentially, his manager wanted him to go to Parra, play with Mitchell Moses. But obviously, as I said, Cameron Ciraldo, Luke Vella – the relationship there and where the bulldogs are as a club; they’re sitting in top of the ladder. It’s a different situation to where Parramatta are. Parramatta are completely rebuilding. Perhaps he didn’t want to be part of that rebuild. Perhaps what he saw at Canterbury or heard from the club was what interested him the most.

Gould: You’re guessing.

Chammas: No, I’m not guessing.

Gould: You haven’t spoken to Lachlan Galvin, you’re guessing. You’re putting out a heap of scenarios.

Chammas: But you’ve told me you haven’t spoken to Lachlan Galvin either, so you and I are as equally educated on the situation.

Gould: Yeah, but I’m not commenting on what he’s saying.

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