‘I play a chord and she says, play a better one’: Finneas on making hits with Billie Eilish

For someone who’s won 10 Grammys and two Academy Awards for best original song, Finneas O’Connell comes across like his sister, Billie Eilish – as refreshingly genuine and free of pretensions.

I worried I might be one of 20 journalists scheduled to speak with him the day of our call, but he reassured me he caps interviews for a reason. “I want to make sure that I’m giving a thoughtful answer to every question,” he says. “And sometimes if you stack too many [interviews] in a row you’re giving answers that feel like you’re being lazy.”

No one could accuse O’Connell of laziness. As well as being his sister’s producer and co-writer, the 27-year-old has worked with the likes of Drake, Selena Gomez and Camila Cabello, written film scores for The Fallout and Vengeance, and also releases music as a solo artist.

His new LP For Cryin’ Out Loud! was made just after he’d finished work on Eilish’s latest album Hit Me Hard and Soft and wrapped the score for new Apple TV+ series Disclaimer, directed by celebrated Mexican filmmaker Alfonso Cuaron. Next, O’Connell and Eilish were plunged into awards season, which involved collecting statues at the Golden Globes, Grammys and Academy Awards, and sometimes performing, too.

Some restful time sipping coconuts on the beach would have been well-earned, but O’Connell had the opposite impulse and dived straight into his new solo album.

“It was partially a coping mechanism for the comedown of these events where you’re nervous to be there, and excited, and sometimes feeling impostor syndrome, but it’s all an honour,” he says. “I thought, when this all suddenly ends, I better have something to distract myself with so I’m not just playing Fortnite all day.”

This wasn’t the usual record-making experience for O’Connell, however. On previous releases he’d hole up in his studio for what was typically a lengthy, arduous and solitary process. This time he grabbed a group of friends, all fellow producers and musicians he admires, to jam in the studio for a few days.

All songs on the album bar one are a result of those sessions, with most lyrics written at the same time as the music. For O’Connell, the reasoning behind this new approach to recording was simple: he just wanted to enjoy himself.

“I was listening to guitar parts that I was loving that I wasn’t coming up with myself, and keyboard lines that I was impressed by,” he says. “It was really fun to be a participant in something and it was also very helpful as a producer because it allowed me to be reactive … It allowed me to be a better judge of the music.”

The result is a record that sounds more hopeful and upbeat than O’Connell’s previous work (2021’s Optimist was actually a rather gloomy album). The nostalgic Cleats, which might be a memory of a high school love unrequited, arrives in a flurry of jaunty, sunny guitars, while the fulsome-sounding band in the chorus lends weight to O’Connell’s falsetto. On the title track, his voice, back in baritone mode, is burnished by horn sections and occasional harmonies. Lotus Eater seems the likeliest hit on the album, with a skipping drum beat forming a backbone for warm, ’80s-style guitar lines and a soaring chorus.

“I love the energy of that song, I love the instrumentation,” says O’Connell. “I’m proud of so many other songs, too, but that one specifically was so fun to record and write and has also been really fun to rehearse and perform.”

Starf---er, the only song that wasn’t produced and recorded with the band (it was written a year before the others), is a caustic ballad about a ruthless social climber, and a rare occasion in which nice guy Finneas reveals some fangs.

“I try not to write songs that are just slams of people; often in a relationship you’re both culpable in a way,” he says, adding that the lyrics are an amalgam of his own experience and friends’ encounters. “But that song is born out of feeling like you’ve really got someone’s number and you’ve figured out that their intentions are not pure.”

O’Connell is about to perform a run of solo shows in the US before bringing the new-album tour to Australia in January. In between he’ll play a concert in Los Angeles with Eilish, who’s just kicked off a huge sold-out international arena tour.

The siblings have a famously close relationship, celebrated in a sweet ballad called Family Feud on O’Connell’s new record. He sings affectionately about their bond and about the challenges of watching his sister, who is four years his junior, grow up in the spotlight. A few months ago O’Connell clapped back when a commenter on social media accused Eilish of “queer-baiting” on Guess, her recent collaboration with Charli XCX, and his protective instincts are palpable in the tender tone and soft-plucked guitar of Family Feud.

Finneas O’Connell, Billie Eilish and their mum Maggie Baird (centre) at Glamour’s Women of the Year Awards in New York this month.Credit: Evan Agostini/Invision/AP

O’Connell is an integral part of Eilish’s creative process. How important is her input when it comes to his solo work? “I care a ton about what she thinks, and I think she also cares a lot about being supportive of me,” he says. “Our job is to be kind of judgmental of each other. She does a vocal take and I say, ‘you can do better’, and I play a chord and she says, ‘play a better one’.”

Disclaimer, scored by O’Connell, debuted on Apple TV+ this month. Alfonso Cuaron’s series, about a high-profile journalist who becomes a character in a mysterious book, boasts an all-star cast including Cate Blanchett, Kevin Kline and Kodi Smit-McPhee.

O’Connell met Cuaron back in 2018, when the director used to bring his daughter Boo to Billie Eilish concerts. The men started chatting, became friends and soon began sending each other playlists. When Cuaron decided to take on Disclaimer he asked if O’Connell would like to do the music for it.

“I kind of panicked because I’d never scored anything at the time, and certainly not a TV show,” recalls O’Connell. “And he was like, ‘Ah, I’ve never made a TV show, either. It’s gonna be great!’” The 18-month-long experience of learning to score for television was “one of the most challenging and fulfilling experiences of my career”, O’Connell says.

As his star continues to rise, largely as a result of his creative partnership with Eilish, does he feel more pressure on his solo projects as his work becomes the subject of increasing scrutiny?

“Sometimes I love [a song] and I want to share it. Sometimes I love it but I feel like nobody wins if I put this song out, so I’m just gonna keep it on a hard drive,” he says, noting that he writes music for himself first and foremost, and is still the executive producer on his own records.

“I think I care less about stuff that’s outside of my control, like the critical response or the sales figures or whether something’s a big hit or not.

“There was not very much ego involved in this record; I just was really excited about the process. I just wanted to have a good time making stuff.”

For Cryin’ Out Loud! is available now. Finneas will perform at Brisbane’s Fortitude Music Hall on January 9; Sydney’s Hordern Pavilion on January 11; and Melbourne’s Forum on January 13.

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