Aussie podcast star Zara McDonald on Blake Lively scandal: ‘Algorithms were being weaponised to change how people think’
Zara McDonald, the co-founder of Shameless Media, reflects on the ‘It Ends With Us’ backlash – and how social media algorithms were ‘being weaponised to change the way people think’.
It was the Hollywood scandal that nearly “cancelled” Blake Lively and turned the release of the movie It Ends With Us into a full-scale feud.
In a new interview with the Stellar podcast Something To Talk About, Zara McDonald – the co-founder of Shameless Media and co-host of the “Shameless” podcast – reflects on the It Ends With Us backlash, and how social media algorithms were “being weaponised to change the way people think”.
McDonald and her “Shameless” co-host, Michelle Andrews, released a podcast titled “The ‘It Ends With Us Mess’” in August, around the time of the movie’s release.
The mega-popular Melbourne-based writers, podcast hosts and pop culture experts analysed the apparent feud between the movie’s star/producer/director Justin Baldoni, and the rest of the cast – including Lively.
Listen to Zara McDonald on the latest episode of the Stellar podcast, Something To Talk About:
In the nuanced conversation, McDonald and Andrews considered the manipulation of the internet to push certain narratives, and how algorithms could be “gamed”.
Now, in a new interview with Something To Talk About, McDonald explains the impact of the Shameless episode, which is one of Shameless’s most listened-to podcasts in the brand’s history.
“I think with that conversation, we knew that there would be people that would find it unpopular. We knew people would disagree with us, which is completely fine,” McDonald told Something To Talk About.
“What we really wanted to talk about was how algorithms were being weaponised to change how people think. Like, that was the fundamental point that we wanted to communicate.
“And I think for me it was single-handedly one of the most terrifying things that I’d seen in the job, because I thought, ‘this could fundamentally change how the internet functions’. It could fundamentally change how conversations function.”
McDonald added: “With that in mind, it was it wasn’t even a question of whether we would have that conversation, because in my gut, I was like, I do kind of think this is the kind of conversation that … if it doesn’t age perfectly or if it doesn’t land perfectly today with every single person that listens to it, OK.
“Once we put that out, we had spent so many hours on it that there was nothing else we could have done or changed. So at that point, I was like, ‘it’s OK if people disagree’,” she told Something To Talk About.
“I just know that this is the conversation we wanted to have. And I think to this day it is wildly … our most listened to episode.
“Like, it just went bananas. I do think the way that algorithms have been ‘gamed’ and will continue to be gamed against women, or against minorities, is something we have to be really alive to.”
McDonald and Andrews co-founded Shameless Media, which spans multiple podcast and media titles and examines the major players of the glossy celebrity world, achieving 100 million “lifetime downloads” this year.
The idea for podcast Shameless – which positions itself a”for smart people who love dumb stuff” – was born in 2018, when the Melbourne-based duo were working together as writers and bonded over a love of popular culture.
Listen to Zara McDonald on the latest episode of the Stellar podcast, Something To Talk About:
Reflecting on Shameless’s success, McDonald told Something To Talk About how she deals with online criticism: “I’m not a completely bullish person who is made of steel, who doesn’t care what anyone thinks. I have always cared too much about what people think of me. And so to find myself in this job is kind of, I think my 18 year old self would be like, ‘God, are you going to be okay doing that?’
“And so I just had to go and see my psych a lot. And we had a lot of conversations. And I just remember her saying like, you need to build armour.
“Whether it’s genuine or not. You need to build armour and make yourself bigger than this job, otherwise it will squash you.”
Listen to the full interview with Shameless Media co-founder Zara McDonald on the new episode of the Stellar podcast Something To Talk About out now.
For more from Stellar and Something To Talk About, click here.
Originally published as Aussie podcast star Zara McDonald on Blake Lively scandal: ‘Algorithms were being weaponised to change how people think’
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