Max Gawn talks to Mark Robinson about how his career has evolved at Melbourne

WHEN Max Gawn was 17 he was was busted for smoking in his car at training, but the Melbourne ruckman tells MARK ROBINSON he’s proud of the person he has become.

Melbourne ruckman Max Gawn speaks to Mark Robinson. Picture: Wayne Ludbey

WHEN Max Gawn was 17 he was was busted for smoking in his car turning up to training, but the Melbourne ruckman tells MARK ROBINSON he’s proud of the person he has become.

MARK ROBINSON: So, you used to be a smoker?

MAX GAWN: I used to like a social smoke when I was a teenager.

And got caught smoking in your car turning up for training at Casey?

I may have been caught doing something I should not have been doing. But that quickly got wiped out when I did caught. I said: “Sorry, guys, it was a misjudgement.”

Who were the guys?

The leadership group and coach Dean Bailey. I’m not a dumbass and I’m aware you shoudn’t be smoking on the way to footy training, or smoking at all, but I wasn’t aware how serious and professional the AFL system was. I was 17 at the time.

Big wake-up call?

I probably had a few wake-up calls early on. I was late a couple of times, had high skin folds early on as well. I had professional issues which I had to overcome.

And two knee reconstructions?

One in 2009, the other in 2012.

And now we’re saying, Max Gawn the All-Australian ruckman.

I haven’t got it yet. I’m 24 and I know I’ve still got a lot of stuff to improve on. And I know I haven’t played (Aaron) Sandilands or (Nic) Naitanui or Kurt Tippet this season. I got pretty lucky not having to come up against them, but also pretty unlucky because I wanted to test myself against the best. I versed Naitainui two years ago and he taught me what ruck work was.

Did you always believe this standard of ruck work was coming or has it been welcome surprise for even you?

Early on in my career, I cursed being the second ruck. Of my first 35 games, in only two of them was I the No.1 ruckman. There was 33 games there with Mark Jamar the No.1 ruckman, so there was a lot of time playing forward and, for an unsuccessful side, almost the the first person dropped is the forward-ruck. At that time, I had to start training as a forward and I was a little bit slow, little bit gangly and sometimes I struggled to work out the quick ball movement.

Max Gawn is in All-Australian form but says he can still improve his game. Pictue: Wayne Ludbey

Rapt to be playing AFL or was it a frustrating time for you not to play ruck?

It’s great playing AFL, but it’s frustrating getting dropped before you get a chance to play in your AFL position. At Casey, I rucked 100 per cent of game time and when I played at Melbourne it was 60 per cent forward and 40 per cent ruck.

This started under Mark Neeld. Any issues with Neeld?

I loved Mark Neeld. He and I clicked. He had a real hardline approach and I like being pushed hard. I played some good footy under him as well. I’m not a coach, but coaching is a different ball game. There’s 45 people you’ve got to try to please. I’m sure there’s people who have an interesting relationship with Roosy. But me and Mark Neeld got along well.

You wear No.11 and I’m told before each game you have a quiet few minutes with the jumper in respect to Jim Stynes? True?

We have a unique time, after our team meeting and before we run out, of two or three minutes. I do what I have to do and then grab the jumper and look at the 11. When I first got to the club Jimmy pointed me out straight away. He liked how different I was. He thought he was different; he saw the resemblance. He liked the ruck thing, and he left me with “Whatever It Takes”, which was his motto.

I got No.37, which was the first number he played in, and Jimmy presented it to me and I’ve still got the photo. And then I got 11 when Mitch Clark went to Geelong. So, one minute before we run out, that motto comes into my head, which usually gets me into a good mindset.

What does it mean to you, “Whatever It Takes”, in respect to football?

In two hours of football there’s going to be times when I’m f---ed and I can’t go any more and that’s when Jim comes into it. Before the game, I think, “What’s the worse that can happen to me today — get a cramp?” — and that I’m going to give it everything I can.

I’ve also been told that you’re a terrific judge of character.

It’s probably one of my qualities I think I do have. We do this thing called DISC profiling at the club. It’s basically helps people with relationships and knowing different characteristics. There’s dominant people, there’s guys a little bit quiet, guys who are loud and fun and exciting. In football clubs, you do get enforcer-type people like Jack Viney and Nathan Jones, just intense. I found I was able to put players in their profiles straight away

What does DISC stand for?

D is dominant, I is influential, S is .... um, because I’m a high I and a high D, I don’t think of S and C (laughing) ... that’s why I can’t think of them.

Melbourne ruckman Max Gawn says he’s developed into a person he’s proud of. Picture: Wayne Ludbey

How does it help you?

It helps with my leadership. I just told you where I’ve come from in terms of professionalism. To get into that leadership role was something I had to work pretty hard on. I love being a leader. I have this selfish factor that I like to be leader, knowing that I’m changing people’s careers, knowing I’m making an influence and knowing I can step up when leaders need to and do the right thing by the team.

Difficult being a “character’’ and a leader?

People I looked up to, such as Jim, had that professionalism but also that character. That’s the person I want to be. As much as they are the best captains, the Nathan Jones and Jack Vineys, you can’t have a whole leadership group of six Jack Vineys because we’ll be running into walls all day long.

Is footy absolutely dominant or do you have diverse interests outside?

Footy is a full-time job so it’s pretty hectic and the coaches encourage you to think about football a lot. But what’s been introduced in the past two years is making sure you’ve got your off-field set up as well. I’m a sports nut, but not a footy nut. I like cricket, I like tennis.

You like your coffee.

It’s art, coffee. I’m interested in beans, coming all the way from Brazil, Ethiopia, middle-to-the-equator-type countries. Just the different temperatures you have to roast beans at ... I find it very interesting, other people find it quite boring.

So what’s that going to lead to?

Pop-up cafes, food trucks. I’m in the pipelines of getting a food truck right now.

Coffee?

Jaffles and coffee.

Jaffles? What type of jaffles?

Maybe a list of 10. Do your ham and cheese and maybe go exotic with chicken, pumpkin and you have to have baked beans. You can’t have a jaffle without baked beans.

When do you want to get a jaffles truck up and running?

Work on it in the off-season.

Gawn celebrates a goal earlier this year. Picture: George Salpigtidis

Are you married, Max?

No, girlfriend (Jess) of two years. She jumped on at the right time. She hasn’t been to Casey Fields (laughing). She’s James Frawley’s girlfriend’s sister. It makes Christmas easier with James there (laughing). I wonder what the dad is thinking of his two sons-in-law. It could get interesting.

You don’t appear to be a person who stresses over football?

I did. The way I played my best footy, or I thought it did, was to get as serious as I could before the game. Wind yourself up, lots of contact, lots of tackling, yelling, screaming ... I thought I was that guy. But I played the game way too early, before the game started. I went out and I was flat a lot of times because I had spent the previous two hours being energised. I didn’t know any different. I didn’t think I could laugh and smile and read the Record before the game.

Neil Craig (former coaching official) was a pretty serious coach and when game day came it was serious time. I remember Craigy used to send me and Jack Watts to another room because me and Wattsy tended to be the ones to be light-hearted and get ourselves down rather than up before a game. At Etihad one game, we were sent down to one of the rooms down the hallway and chucked a tennis ball to each other and read the Record.

And the teammates?

Probably getting serious.

When did it change?

When I got back into the team after Casey. I tried reading the Record, tried reading the newspaper. I gave up the paper because at interstate games I found those papers boring, so I couldn’t do the same thing consistently everywhere. I still read the Record, go through the quiz, make jokes with the physios and the guys who do the taping. In the warm-up, I’m still light-hearted and a bit jovial, but as soon as I get back in, I do some boxing, the meeting, and then the jumper and I’m ready to go.

Is footy off the menu at the home?

You’ve got to make the phone calls to Mum and Dad because they’re pretty proud parents who knew nothing about footy and who have slowly become experts. I call them after games. I remember when the recruiters used to come around home. I was 17, and I’d be asking questions about the draft, and the football clubs, but Mum would say (he impersonates his mum), “So when the ball gets kicked for a goal, does it come back to the centre. (laughing).’’ They had no idea when I first started and now they reckon they are experts. At home, I don’t rush to watch footy, I don’t have the TV on Fox Footy all the time.

Is it right to describe you as a “character’’.

I sometimes think why people do call me character. Maybe I don’t run to cliches in the football world. I don’t know ... I’ve got a beard?

It’s a rare combo, the shaved head and the beard.

I like being different.

Max Gawn has modelled his game on Giants rival Shane Mumford. Picture: Wayne Ludbey

Players always say they love the club. What’s your affection towards Melbourne?

I wouldn’t change my career even though I had those two recos because the first four years I was basically watching the game in the stands with the fans. I was a supporter and fell in love with the club. I found myself yelling in the crowd. I wouldn’t have got that if I didn’t have my recos. I would’ve been at Casey, not watching the team and probably getting frustrated. It was time when I could just fall in love with the club.

How are you dealing with the adulation and the media attention?

I casually said I ate a pizza at Dominoes and it made headlines for a couple of months, so it’s amazing what little things people enjoy knowing about you. I don’t mind it, but I don’t chase it. I used to hate it, and the club covered it up for years — the smoking story — but to be honest I couldn’t care. That’s what I was at 17, but I have developed into this new person I’m proud of.

MAX GAWN ON HIS RUCK RIVALS

MARK ROBINSON: Your opposition analysis is said to be freaky. I want to throw some names of ruckmen at you and give me your thoughts. Aaron Sandilands?

MAX GAWN: You’re right, I’m a big ruck nerd. Sandilands. I’ve versed him once — is versed a word? — I’ve played against him once. I remember one of the coaches said: “He’s a big boy so make sure you run him around.” It’s a bizarre thing because he’s one of the fittest in the comp. He runs you around. I’m almost the same size, but he still clearly wins hits. His ruck craft is probably the best.

Shane Mumford?

I try to model my game on his a bit. Obviously we’re different because I’ve got the height and he’s a bit of brute. He’s the bench mark of following up. For a while there, I had a motto of wanting to be the guy who everyone wants to play with, which is almost the ruckman motto, and Mumford’s got that to a T. Into specifics, he’s not selfish, he doesn’t worry about his numbers, he makes big tackles, big bumps and he’s a got a direct correlation with them winning.

Todd Goldstein?

He set the benchmark for the fitness you need as a ruckman. He runs plenty, covers the ground and his ruck craft is super as well. He gets his hand up nice and high which is something I struggled with as young ruckman. The main thing that stands out is his 95 per cent game time.

Nic Naitanui?

Only played him once. His centre bounce craft is the best, better than Sandilands. You go in against jumpers — ruck-nerd terminology, jumpers — but Tom Hickey likes to jump, Brodie Grundy, Nic Naitanui like to jump. You try to take their space a bit, cramp them, try to make them stay down, but Nic Nat always manages to jump. People try to shut down his strength and they can’t do it. Around the ground, he’s strong, his reach, his follow up is super, contested possessions are good. People pot his marking but his marking is quite strong.

Who is underrated as a ruckman?

Sam Jacobs is very underrated. I had a great battle with him. I enjoyed my time. We had a laugh and a joke and played serious footy as well. I like “Sauce”. I try to figure out what a ruckman is like nice and early. I talk to them and if they grunt back I know I’m in for a non-talking day.

You talk to Mumford?

He starts the convo, Mummy (laughing). Early on in the Neeld era, we were in Sydney versus Mumford and Pyke. And Mummy goes: “Why haven’t they been playing you?’’ And then he goes on a 150m sprint. I tried to follow him as much as I could and once we stopped I bent down to have a bit of a puff, and he says: ‘Oh, that’s why. You’re f---ing unfit.’’