One Nation members filmed asking NRA for millions in donations
One Nation’s James Ashby and Steve Dickson have vehemently denied they were seeking donations from America’s gun lobby, saying their comments came after a long drinking session. WATCH THE SECRET VIDEO.
One Nation’s James Ashby says he and state leader Steve Dickson were “on the sauce” when they were caught on tape making comments about getting $20 million from US gun lobby officials.
The pair faced the media to respond to the footage, which was secretly recorded by undercover reporter Rodger Muller from Al Jazeera.
They said the conversation came after a three to four-hour drinking session with Muller, who was posing as an Australian gun rights lobbyist as part of a three-year investigation.
“These conversations with the NRA were to look at nothing more than their techniques. This was not about sourcing money from the NRA,” chief of staff Mr Ashby said.
“This was about sourcing technology, sourcing an understanding of how they operate, but never was it about seeking $20 million from the NRA.
“The conversations that were recorded when there was talk of $20 million — I’ll be the first to admit, we’d arrived in America, we’d got on the sauce, we’d had a few drinks and that’s where those discussions took place,” Mr Ashby said.
“Not with any potential donors, no one bar Rodger Muller, Steve Dickson and myself.”
Mr Dickson singled out undercover reporter Rodger Muller, who had invited the pair to the US for a meeting at the National Rifle Association headquarters in Virginia.
“I never, ever suspected, in my wildest dreams, that this guy was employed by Al Jazeera as an Australian spy to interfere in politics,” Mr Dickson said.
Mr Dickson described the set-up as “like something of out of a James Bond magazine”.
MARK LATHAM WEIGHS IN
One Nation’s NSW leader Mark Latham has slammed his federal colleagues’ decision to solicit funding from the NRA, saying it was a “mistake” and urging them to change their position on guns.
“I hope they do a U-turn here and start supporting what we’ve done in NSW, support the Howard gun laws, support abolition of any foreign donations and acknowledge what they’ve done in the United States was perhaps quite a mistake,” he told 2GB.
Mr Latham said the actions of his federal colleagues did not “bear as a reflection of my thinking” – indicating there are cracks in party unity just three days since he was elected to NSW’s Upper House as the One Nation leader.
“It’s not something I would ever do or think about or support it’s not reflected in what we did for NSW One Nation,” he said.
He added: “For 23 years I’ve been a supporter of the Howard laws after the Port Arthur massacre in 1996 they’ve kept Australia free of public massacres, we’re not like the United States we’ve got an assurance — touch wood — as parents that our kids come home from school in that afternoon, that we can go and go to the shopping in malls without the sort of tragedy you see in the United States.”
“I’ve been an opponent of their gun laws for as long as I can remember, I’ve been around in politics for 25 years I’ve never had any contact with the NRA and in fact in this recent election campaign I put out… gun control policy that said I’m supporting the Howard gun laws and wouldn’t tolerate a single change to those and I reiterated that in the closing days of the campaigning supporting the way Jacinda Ardern in New Zealand is moving much closer to the Australian gun laws,” he said.
Mr Latham also moved to distance himself from One Nation having solicited cash from a foreign donor.
“My position couldn’t be clearer -- I’ve always been an opponent of foreign donations in politics, of foreign influence in politics.”
Mr Latham said he didn’t believed One Nation federal leader Pauline Hanson was aware of what Steve Dickson or James Ashby were doing in America with the NRA.
“I’d be very surprised if she was, I don’t think this has happened with her approval or direction,” he said.
He was at pains to stress that he wasn’t responsible for the actions of Queensland’s One Nation members.
He also claimed the Al Jazeera investigation that exposed Mr Ashby and Mr Dickson’s behavior was a “sting, a trap” and claimed it was “completely unethical”.
PM SLAMS ONE NATION FOOTAGE
Earlier, Scott Morrison accused One Nation of offering to “sell Australia’s gun laws to the highest bidders”.
But the Prime Minister rejected calls to preference the party last at the upcoming election despite mounting pressure after the footage emerged overnight.
Mr Morrison declared the footage, published overnight by Al Jazeera after a three-year investigation, was one of “many reasons not to vote for One Nation”.
He said the Liberals would not determine their preferences until nominations closed however, saying there were “many candidates for who should go last”.
“There are many reasons not to vote for One Nation. It’s a long list. We’ve seen some of those on display in recent times,” Mr Morrison said today.
“Today we saw further evidence of that, where we have reports that One Nation officials basically sought to sell Australia’s gun laws to the highest bidders to a foreign buyer.
“I find that abhorrent.”
Mr Morrison urged Australians who had previously voted for One Nation to back the Coalition instead, saying the party was too “extreme” and could not deliver on its promises.
Prime Minister Morrison dubbed the report “deeply concerning” while senior government ministers labelled One Nation’s actions “sickening” and “incredibly shocking”.
“Reports that senior One Nation officials courted foreign political donations from the US gun lobby to influence our elections and undermine our gun laws that keep us safe are deeply concerning,” Mr Morrison said in a statement on Twitter this morning.
“Australia’s gun laws are world’s best thanks to John Howard and we will not be changing them.”
He added the government had introduced laws to criminalise taking foreign political donations.
Trade Minister Simon Birmingham and Deputy Nationals leader Bridget McKenzie demanded One Nation leader Pauline Hanson “front the cameras today” to explain whether she was colluding with the US gun lobby to relax the nation’s gun control laws.
“This is exactly the type of behaviour we were seeking to stop by bringing in our foreign donation law,” Senator McKenzie told Sky News.
“I think it’s incredibly shocking, these revelations.
“And rather than issue a media statement, I’d ask Senator Hanson to actually front the media and come out and say whether she actually agrees with the article and the information provided by the media.”
Senator McKenzie, a shooting enthusiast, added: “I’m a licenced firearm owner. I well and truly know and appreciate the positive economic, social and environmental benefit that shooting and hunting sports provide to our nation but I think the NRA and the type of behaviour they want to see rolled out in countries across the world is not fit for purpose for our nation.”
“I think it’s outrageous that they’re going over and selling some sort of level of influence that they can flip overnight our legislative agenda,” she said, adding it looked like One Nation “had dollar signs in their eyes”.
“We need to make sure all our legislation, including our firearm regulation, reflects who we are as a nation and how we want to regulate a variety of issues within our borders,” Senator McKenzie said.
“We don’t need Americans telling us how to do it.”
Senator Birmingham said: “(Pauline Hanson) should explain whether or not she was truly seeking an amazing $20 million in foreign donations to One Nation, to her political party, whether or not she was again expecting to personally profit from an election campaign, whether or not she actually believes we should be weakening Australia’s gun laws, which is a remarkable thing to even contemplate at this time of reflection upon the tragedy in Christchurch.”
“There are many answers here for One Nation, who are a risk to our trade policy, who are a risk to our national harmony and integrity, and who appear to be a risk to our foreign donation law bans and to our gun laws as well,” he told ABC radio.
He indicated the Coalition should preference One Nation last at the upcoming election, saying he wanted to see everybody who nominated but it was his view that “Australians ought to reject extremism in all its forms”.
Minister for Women Kelly O’Dwyer, who is leaving politics at the election, said: “I can’t see any reason why One Nation wouldn’t be preferenced last.”
“Obviously that is a matter for the party organisation,” she said.
“In my seat of Higgins, I would expect that One Nation would be put last.
“I think most people would be horrified at the thought that a political party in this country was seeking foreign donations to try and change our gun laws that have kept so many Australians safe.”
Opposition leader Bill Shorten accused One Nation of “conspiring” with the NRA to “Americanise” Australia’s gun laws, dubbing their actions “absolutely horrifying”.
“I think it was a betrayal of the Australian political system. What are these right-wing extremists thinking,” Mr Shorten told reporters in Sydney.
He called on Mr Morrison to put the party last for its preference flows at the election.
“This is now a test of Mr Morrison’s leadership,” he said.
“To see a party who may receive the government’s preferences caught out on video boasting about taking money, watering down Australia’s protections, trying to Americanise our gun laws - what more does Mr Morrison need to show some spine and put One Nation last.”
One Nation MP Mark Latham, who won a seat in NSW state election at the weekend, publicly backed Australia’s strong gun laws in the wake of the Christchurch massacre.
WHAT THE VIDEO SHOWED
The Al Jazeera investigation, broadcast overnight on Monday, features a recording of the meeting in Washington, DC in September 2018, captured by undercover journalist Rodger Mueller.
Mr Dickson reportedly told NRA officials that it would be like a “poison” for the world to look to Australia as a model for gun control.
“If we don’t change things, people are going to be looking at Australia and go ‘Well, it’s OK for them to go down the path of not having guns, it’s OK for them to go down that politically-correct path’,” he is alleged to have said.
“And it’s like a poison — it will poison us all unless we stop it.”
Mr Ashby is also reportedly heard saying that $US20 million in donations to One Nation from US pro-gun lobbyists would give them parliamentary influence in Australia.
“If you had 20 ($US20 million), you would own the Lower House and the Upper House,” the recording states.
The pair were covertly filmed as part of a sting which featured a fake lobby group called Gun Rights Australia, which used a middle man to set up meetings between the Australians and the NRA.
During one of the meetings Mr Ashby and Mr Dickson speak with senior NRA officials and begin discussing communications strategies for when mass shootings occur.
NRA media liaison Lars Daleside offered them advice on what to do.
“How dare you stand on the graves of those children to put forward your political agenda?” she said. “Just shame them to the whole idea.”
“I love that,” Mr Dickson replied.
“It is like, ‘if your policy is not good enough to stand on itself, how are you use their deaths to push that forward?”
“That’s very good, very strong,” Mr Ashby said.
Both Mr Ashby and Mr Dickson were concerned about the backlash if the meetings with the lobby group became public.
“If it gets out, it’ll f**king rock the boat,” Mr Ashby said.
“This s**t goes through my head every single minute of my day.”
ONE NATION DEMANDS INVESTIGATION
One Nation has asked ASIO and the AFP to investigate Al Jazeera’s reporting following the explosive revelations overnight.
“Al Jazeera are a state owned propaganda arm of the Qatari government that supports Islamic extremist groups and are not a legitimate media organisation,” One Nation said in a statement today.
“One Nation was invited by Rodger Muller, who has now been outed as a foreign agent working for Al Jazeera to meet with the NRA, American business leaders and attend the Congressional Sportsman’s Dinner.
“One Nation has asked Al Jazeera to show complete transparency and release the full context of conversations.
“The matter has been referred to ASIO and the Australian Federal Police due to concerns of foreign interference into Australian politics in the lead up to the imminent federal election.”
The statement claims One Nation was “targeted” because of its calls to reduce immigration numbers and put a “travel ban on countries with terrorism links”.
“One Nation strongly supports the rights of lawful gun ownership within Australia and have clearly outlined our policy on our website,” it says.
It claims the “secretly recorded conversations” occurred in September 2018.
An AFP spokesman confirmed the police had received a referral from One Nation.
“This referral will be assessed in accordance with AFP standard protocols. As such, it would not be appropriate to comment further at this stage,” he told News Corp Australia.
ASIO declined to comment.
“ASIO has no comment,” a spokesman said.
The NRA declined to respond to Al Jazeera about its investigation and documentary.
The meeting came not long before legislation cleared federal parliament in November banning foreign donations.
Attorney-General Christian Porter said the footage “cause a fair degree of concern”.
He praised Australia’s gun laws introduced by the Howard Government after the Port Arthur massacre but would not be drawn on whether One Nation could be in breach of donations laws.
Asked whether the Coalition should preference One Nation last at the election, Mr Porter said he would rather wait to see everyone that nominated.
“If a Fraser Anning type of person was in my seat, that is the person that I would like to see put last,” he told the ABC.
UNDERCOVER AUSSIE SAYS NRA ‘BIZARRE’
The Australian man who went undercover as a gun lobbyist for three years to help Al Jazeera infiltrate NRA meetings and film One Nation’s private talks with gun lobby officials has opened up about the “bizarre” world he encountered, including meeting Donald Trump Jr.
Rodger Muller has also spoken about what it cost him personally.
“Those around me at the NRA convention wore hats, T-shirts and badges, declaring their undying love for the ‘God-given right’ to carry a weapon,” he wrote in an editorial published by Al Jazeera today.
“It became very clear to me that, if I wanted to sound believable, I had to espouse those same passions.
“That was not easy. I am genuinely proud of Australia’s gun control laws, and to rail against ‘snowflakes’ and ‘gun grabbers’ seemed like a betrayal of my friends and family back home, who I believe are safe because of such tough laws.
“Many of them were astonished at my new-found passion for firearms. I brushed most queries off saying, ‘It’s a scary world out there. I’ve realised that guns can keep us all safe — so I’m campaigning for more guns here’.
“But not everyone was happy with such explanations. On more than one occasion, strangers who had seen the Gun Rights Australia website confronted me on the street and berated me for trying to drag Australia’s gun laws in the direction of those in the US.”
Mr Muller reflected on the sometimes “amusing” and at other times “utterly bizarre” encounters with the pro-gun community.
“At one gathering, an albino python was released onto a lawn and a tiger paced in a cage for the amusement of cocktail-sipping guests,” he wrote.
“There, I spoke to Donald Trump Jr, the son of the US president and an outspoken gun rights advocate.
“Wayne LaPierre, the NRA chief, applauded as my presence was announced by an MC. At another event, I fired shotguns at clay pigeons beside US congressmen, and posed for a photograph with Chris Cox, a chief lobbyist for the NRA.”
Mr Muller said when he approached Mr Ashby, the One Nation staffer said he wanted to meet his NRA contacts.
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